Grove Collaborative Holdings, Inc.

Uh, the second was the inspiration from so many of the companies that I had been talking to as a result of writing Better Business.

You know, one that really stands out that was really influential was the company Grove Collaborative, which is in the Bay Area in the US, and they sort of sell, market a variety of, you know, sort of home good type of, type of products, so, you know, soaps and cleaning fluids, et cetera.

And you know, they, those type of products are liquids, and so traditionally they would need some sort of plastic, you know, plastic container.

And the co-founder, Stu Landsberg, said to me once when I was talking to him, he said, "You know, when I think about the responsibility of Grove, Grove Collaborative, what I think about is what is the biggest area of damage that we do? And that is where I should be focusing my attention, not some random You know, volunteering program or other sort of maybe more minor sustainability program, but, like, what is the core issue? And for them, it was plastic.

And so they set off on this path of becoming zero plastic, which for their product category is really, really hard, potentially virtually impossible.

And what this allowed them to do is actually see a lot of innovations.

Those are examples of where probably sh-- the company should have-- there should be some sort of, you know, could be a tax, could be some other, uh, you know, mechanism to actually incorporate that cost, damage to the Earth, damage to the community, damage to individuals' health, uh, which are those sort of socialization, um, of the cost.

So really it's things that are, you know, leading to higher profit for companies, but actually probably should be c-- or that are costs that they're putting off on society and the environment.